Post by kelemvor » Tue Oct 01, 2013 3:09 am

So I want to find all extensions that have to do with Customer Groups.

I type Customer Group in the search box and I get 548 results. Most of which have nothing to do with Customer Groups. So I put it in quotes and type "customer group" in the search box. Now I get 839 results. No idea how making the search more restrictive yields more results, but it obviously doesn't work properly.

It's hard to find if there's an extension out there I can use because searching for them completely sucks.

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Post by Qphoria » Tue Oct 01, 2013 4:20 am

This was a true statement about 2 months ago when it was adjusted to try a new way, but it has been adjusted back to the correct way for months now and is working fine. I searched "customer group" and it returned dozens of correct matches. It uses the mysql fulltext priority matching. Basically the way it works is it finds all the records with both "customer" and "group" in the description. Then after those are listed, it finds just "customer" and just "group". So yea you might get 400 results that might not seem like matches, but who cares.. the ones that matter are returned first so just ignore the rest.

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Post by kelemvor » Tue Oct 01, 2013 4:27 am

Qphoria wrote:This was a true statement about 2 months ago when it was adjusted to try a new way, but it has been adjusted back to the correct way for months now and is working fine. I searched "customer group" and it returned dozens of correct matches. It uses the mysql fulltext priority matching. Basically the way it works is it finds all the records with both "customer" and "group" in the description. Then after those are listed, it finds just "customer" and just "group". So yea you might get 400 results that might not seem like matches, but who cares.. the ones that matter are returned first so just ignore the rest.
But is there no way to find "customer group" as a phrase? If it just finds the words together and ranks them, that means I can't sort the results or I just get all the crap mixed in with the 10% of results that are actually valid. If it can only find the ones with the word Customer followed by the word Group, all the results would be valid up front and then I could sort them and still just have the vaild results.

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Post by CZechBoY » Tue Oct 01, 2013 4:52 am

What do you need?
Describe the module.

Mass update product descriptions/Hromadná změna popisků zboží


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Post by kelemvor » Tue Oct 01, 2013 5:17 am

CZechBoY wrote:What do you need?
Describe the module.
I'm just looking for something that would allow the user to modify their own Customer Group the same way they can set their Customer Group when they sign up. I wanted to simply search for "Customer Group" as a complete phrase since that would make all the results directly relevant to customer groups.

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Post by Qphoria » Tue Oct 01, 2013 10:03 pm

well if you search customer group then you find all the mods that have both "Customer" and "Group" in the title. The first 2 pages for me were all "Customer group discount" and "Customer group override" and "customer group xxxx" etc

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Post by kelemvor » Tue Oct 01, 2013 10:20 pm

Correct. But then if I want to sort/filter them by version or price or anything else, I can't because it brings all the other results into the mix.

I don't know why putting something in quotes doesn't work the way it normally would. Is there a different syntax to use or is it just not possible to search for a specific phrase instead of also including the words separately...

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Post by Johnathan » Tue Oct 01, 2013 11:40 pm

kelemvor wrote:But is there no way to find "customer group" as a phrase? If it just finds the words together and ranks them, that means I can't sort the results or I just get all the crap mixed in with the 10% of results that are actually valid. If it can only find the ones with the word Customer followed by the word Group, all the results would be valid up front and then I could sort them and still just have the vaild results.
Qphoria, do you know if fulltext search looks for "customer group" before finding "customer" and "group" separately? I tried to do some research on fulltext, but couldn't find anything definitive.

If it doesn't do that, I agree with kelemvor that the entire phrase should be searched first. Especially as more and more extensions get added, it's only going to return less relevant results by looking for "customer" and "group" and not just "customer group". Daniel might want to consider adding a normal query for the full phrase first, and then a fulltext search if it's not found.

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Post by Qphoria » Tue Oct 01, 2013 11:54 pm

Johnathan wrote:
kelemvor wrote:But is there no way to find "customer group" as a phrase? If it just finds the words together and ranks them, that means I can't sort the results or I just get all the crap mixed in with the 10% of results that are actually valid. If it can only find the ones with the word Customer followed by the word Group, all the results would be valid up front and then I could sort them and still just have the vaild results.
Qphoria, do you know if fulltext search looks for "customer group" before finding "customer" and "group" separately? I tried to do some research on fulltext, but couldn't find anything definitive.

If it doesn't do that, I agree with kelemvor that the entire phrase should be searched first. Especially as more and more extensions get added, it's only going to return less relevant results by looking for "customer" and "group" and not just "customer group". Daniel might want to consider adding a normal query for the full phrase first, and then a fulltext search if it's not found.
I don't really know.. I just assumed that it does by intelligent design as the first 2 pages of results for me all had "customer" and "group" in the title. It might be nice to add google site search to the extensions area like I did for the forums... the forums would be unusable without it.

You can do it yourself for now, just add

Code: Select all

site:http://www.opencart.com/index.php?route=extension/extension
to any google search
e.g.:

Code: Select all

customer group site:http://www.opencart.com/index.php?route=extension/extension

Code: Select all

"customer group" site:http://www.opencart.com/index.php?route=extension/extension

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Post by Johnathan » Wed Oct 02, 2013 12:02 am

Qphoria wrote:It might be nice to add google site search to the extensions area like I did for the forums... the forums would be unusable without it.
Good suggestion

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Post by kelemvor » Wed Oct 02, 2013 12:23 am

Yeah, I actually went that route yesterday since I'm familiar with tweaking google searches but wanted to bring it up in case anyone else was having issues with it.

Thanks all.

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Post by Qphoria » Wed Oct 02, 2013 1:29 am

I created a simple userscript for it here:
http://userscripts.org/scripts/show/178973
google-sitesearch-exten.jpg

google-sitesearch-exten.jpg (32.08 KiB) Viewed 5450 times


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Post by butte » Fri Oct 04, 2013 7:50 am

Bravo, for the changes, forum-wide and for extensions store.

What I am seeing right now for selected word pairs, triplets, and tetrads that are reasonably posed for three purposes (topic, forums, store) is that the results are Booleanesque enough for phrases first, permutations second, combinations third. For these word choices, and for having no intention of wading through a ream of pages of datadump.

Starting with the Search button and using only the simplest forum-only box, these stay in the house forums. Where there is only one usual way of using the words together, the returns show them as asked as usually used. Where there are two usual ways, the returns show both ways, as asked first, then the other way round. Probably frequencies of encounter by engine govern priority and mix, relative to usages. Unavailable topics probably lead nowhere in-house, not even to ads, as where "Your search - "unkyglot umpl" site:forum.opencart.com - did not match any documents." It did not even dream up any ads "for" that.
"customer group"
"group customer"
"user group"
"group user"

Widening into wherever web-wide might lead, starting with the first "outside" results page, these look apparently everywhere but the datadumps start with the house forums. Returns are as above, but the first dozens of them are restricted to the house forums. Rare topics would probably show those first, before outside forums and other sources. It did dream up two ads "for" the terms, but only those two "Ads related to 'unkyglot umpl' + opencart."
"customer group" + opencart
"group customer" + opencart
"user group" + opencart
"group user" + opencart

Continuing into wherever web-wide might lead, starting with the first or last "outside" results page, these look apparently everywhere but the datadumps start with the house extensions store. Returns are as above, but the first dozens of them are restricted to the house extension store. Probably rare or unavailable extensions would routinely display that, as where web-wide "Your search - "unkyglot umpl" + opencart + extensions - did not match any documents." It did not lop the first phrase and give everything with the other two -- it gave no forum, no store. Here, again, it did dream up three ads "for" the terms, but only those three "Ads related to 'unkyglot umpl' + opencart + extensions" appeared -- apparently odesk and nexternal each paid more than did bigcommerce in order to make both prior and present web-wide searches for the non-tropic.
"customer group" + opencart + extensions
"group customer" + opencart + extensions
"user group" + opencart + extensions
"group user" + opencart + extensions

Qphoria's recent efforts above can probably be turned expediently from the house forums and house store back upon need for something workably similar in OC versions, as where at http://forum.opencart.com/viewtopic.php ... 40#p392644 some time ago I closed with this:
(4) For the sake of development, as well as for the sake of localized code modification, some attention to singulars and plurals as well as to Boolean expectations that most store visitors will have at least dimly in mind would seem appropriate. Granted, OC itself is not intended to be a premium search engine in its own right even internally, but that part of its core doesn't seem to warrant the foregoing several months of virtual silence in this or any similar thread, when the problem isn't dead even in Qphoria's store.

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Post by blindjoedeath » Tue Oct 22, 2013 3:11 am

Just chiming in that better Extensions searching is probably my most desired change for the OC website. I do use Google search instead of normal search (and Qphoria - thanks for the user script), but newbies may not figure that out.

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Post by billynoah » Wed Nov 20, 2013 9:18 am

Sorry I didn't see this thread before I just made a new post about the same thing. I think a big problem here is that the search is case sensitive which is why "Customer Group" and "customer group" return different results. Making a search case sensitive like this seems counterproductive. IMO, it should be fixed.
Last edited by billynoah on Thu Nov 21, 2013 4:04 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Post by butte » Wed Nov 20, 2013 10:23 am

billynoah means http://forum.opencart.com/viewtopic.php ... 38#p456238 and it puts related searches plus "this is no good" in plain limelight. Good.

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