Post by Qphoria » Thu Jan 20, 2011 2:18 pm

CMS made simple looks like it uses xml files with meta data it seems. Confuses even me.

I like a much simpler design .. a single "theme.php" file.. no need for smarty or anything.. the normal php echo still applies. But one file that has all the html code in it and you just add the tags for where you want to call the dynamic data. Granted it means you have the same basic design for all pages, but that is actually the proper design technique. You don't want people getting lost on your site by moving boxes around. I dont want to have the cart on the right side on the home page, then the cart on the left side on the product page, then the cart in the footer on the checkout page. There should be one consistent flow IMO. Even the way the checkout is now, the shipping page is shorter than the payment page so the continue button is higher up. Then on the payment page the continue button is lower, too much moving around.. a template should move very little.

Like these CMS:
http://www.websitebaker2.org/en/help/de ... mplate.php
http://docs.joomla.org/Tutorial:Creatin ... !_template

While others like Wordpress use the current opencart style of theming with dozens of files... its overwhelming and annoying, especially when a lot of them are mostly redundant.

I guess the MVC concept makes it harder, tho you could still keep the separate view for modules.. but it would be so much easier to have just the module code and any extraneous html it needs in one file. Not that you are forced to follow MVC for modules.. I'm thinking about simplifying things for my modules to get rid of the tediosity of the MVC design pattern for addons. MVC is meant more for the core anyway

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Post by gocreative » Thu Jan 20, 2011 3:22 pm

Qphoria wrote:I like a much simpler design .. a single "theme.php" file.. [...] Granted it means you have the same basic design for all pages, but that is actually the proper design technique. You don't want people getting lost on your site by moving boxes around. I dont want to have the cart on the right side on the home page, then the cart on the left side on the product page, then the cart in the footer on the checkout page. There should be one consistent flow IMO.
I agree, but that's not really where the flexibility helps you. It's more for having (in a general sense, not just carts) a unique home page that promotes your business/products/service and then sub-pages have their own look. Or even better, you might have the same layout for all pages but the feature box changes on a particular page, or a secondary (context-relevant) menu appears on some pages that require it. So for me it's more about little tweaks rather than moving major elements around the place. That's definitely not CUE-compliant.

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Post by SapporoGuy » Thu Jan 20, 2011 3:44 pm

I haven't used CMS made simple but web baker came off as a simple modx type of system.
The biggest issue with modx is that it really can be over whelming and has a learning curve.

As for moving stuff around to avoid the MVC problem ... I'm not so sure. I'd be more interested in finding out how you can solve the current problem rather than tack on solution.

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Post by N1kko » Thu Jan 20, 2011 4:20 pm

Qphoria wrote:CMS made simple looks like it uses xml files with meta data it seems. Confuses even me.

I like a much simpler design .. a single "theme.php" file.. no need for smarty or anything.. the normal php echo still applies. But one file that has all the html code in it and you just add the tags for where you want to call the dynamic data. Granted it means you have the same basic design for all pages, but that is actually the proper design technique. You don't want people getting lost on your site by moving boxes around. I dont want to have the cart on the right side on the home page, then the cart on the left side on the product page, then the cart in the footer on the checkout page. There should be one consistent flow IMO. Even the way the checkout is now, the shipping page is shorter than the payment page so the continue button is higher up. Then on the payment page the continue button is lower, too much moving around.. a template should move very little.

Like these CMS:
http://www.websitebaker2.org/en/help/de ... mplate.php
http://docs.joomla.org/Tutorial:Creatin ... !_template

While others like Wordpress use the current opencart style of theming with dozens of files... its overwhelming and annoying, especially when a lot of them are mostly redundant.

I guess the MVC concept makes it harder, tho you could still keep the separate view for modules.. but it would be so much easier to have just the module code and any extraneous html it needs in one file. Not that you are forced to follow MVC for modules.. I'm thinking about simplifying things for my modules to get rid of the tediosity of the MVC design pattern for addons. MVC is meant more for the core anyway

I use Website Baker alot and find it very easy to design some great themes, the template system is superb and allows for different themes for each page if needed which is very handy.

Wordpress, Drupal and other CMS systems are very hard and time consuming when it comes to themes.

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Post by cevarief » Thu Jan 20, 2011 4:28 pm

gocreative wrote:Perhaps, given there's a bit of a wait for 1.5.0 anyway, we could have a theme design contest? Even if the theme was finished after 1.5.0 was released, it could begin its life as an extension, and later become either the 'default' theme or a secondary choice.
Yeah i agree for the contest or event by hiring a designer. In the mean time, developer can find solution for the next templating system.

Personally i hate smarty :crazy:

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Post by i2Paq » Thu Jan 20, 2011 4:30 pm

cevarief wrote:Personally i hate smarty :crazy:
+1

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Post by Rogue » Thu Jan 20, 2011 7:05 pm

sorry if I'm shooting off actual 'feature requests', although I don't think this is one per se.

Could you consider the ability to customize the admin dashboard, or at least apply some restrictions for users on that page too... I am sharing my site with a partner operation, doing their dispatch on their behalf, alongside my own online retail. I use the multistore feature for this and it works well but while I DO want them to have access to some data I do not want them to have access to MY sales figures.

Right now I have hacked a couple of core files to fit my needs. One of them I would fully expect to have to make the effort to tailor as needed for my particular case, but the dashboard is puzzling me as to why all users groups with admin access are fed a fixed set of data. It does not sound very practical for any situation where several people have to manage/access the backend.

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Post by gocreative » Thu Jan 20, 2011 7:41 pm

I'd definitely call that a feature request, though I do agree with you that it would be good to have more granular control over permissions. Unfortunately I can't see that happening any time soon.

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Post by Daniel » Thu Jan 20, 2011 7:54 pm

Rogue wrote:sorry if I'm shooting off actual 'feature requests', although I don't think this is one per se.

Could you consider the ability to customize the admin dashboard, or at least apply some restrictions for users on that page too... I am sharing my site with a partner operation, doing their dispatch on their behalf, alongside my own online retail. I use the multistore feature for this and it works well but while I DO want them to have access to some data I do not want them to have access to MY sales figures.

Right now I have hacked a couple of core files to fit my needs. One of them I would fully expect to have to make the effort to tailor as needed for my particular case, but the dashboard is puzzling me as to why all users groups with admin access are fed a fixed set of data. It does not sound very practical for any situation where several people have to manage/access the backend.
the admin already has this feature under user groups.

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Post by scanreg » Thu Jan 20, 2011 9:14 pm

Looks amazing :)

Any plans to have a homepage category table with pics and descrips displayed in the main body ?

Many of my customers would use it extensively

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Post by OC2PS » Thu Jan 20, 2011 10:02 pm

Qphoria wrote:I like a much simpler design .. a single "theme.php" file..
http://forum.opencart.com/viewtopic.php ... 60#p127395

Check out GreyDragon that comes with Gallery 3. Add a css file to make most changes.

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Post by Qphoria » Thu Jan 20, 2011 10:18 pm

sooskriszta wrote:
Qphoria wrote:I like a much simpler design .. a single "theme.php" file..
http://forum.opencart.com/viewtopic.php ... 60#p127395

Check out GreyDragon that comes with Gallery 3. Add a css file to make most changes.
Why do you keep spamming this Gallery system around.. its not a cart, not even a CMS... and I just downloaded the zip to check it.. and the theme folder has like 10 files in it so its not even a single theme. Let it go

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Post by OC2PS » Thu Jan 20, 2011 11:52 pm

Qphoria wrote:Why do you keep spamming this Gallery system around.. its not a cart, not even a CMS... and I just downloaded the zip to check it.. and the theme folder has like 10 files in it so its not even a single theme. Let it go
Never said it was a cart or CMS. The theme folder may have multiple files, but the point I was making was that if you check out the Grey Dragon theme, pretty much everything can be changed by editing a file custom.css, which overrides the theme's settings.

P.S. *Spamming* is a bit strong. I prefer *parading* ;)

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Post by Daniel » Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:00 am

I can use the current design if thats what people want. no mega menus.

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Post by marc_cole » Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:04 am

cevarief wrote:i hate smarty
Personally, I would like to see the addition of a templating system like PHPTAL. It allows you to use HTML apps like Dreamweaver and actually see what the layout looks like since it uses XML-like tags. Having templates like this would open the door to a lot more designers, since it would make it a heck of a lot easier to design tpl files. This could be very beneficial to the OpenCart community.

It's been under constant development since 2005, so maybe it's worth looking into?

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Post by OC2PS » Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:04 am

Daniel wrote:I can use the current design if thats what people want. no mega menus.
If the mega menus can't be made into a configurable/removable module, then my vote is for current design sans mega menus.

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Post by marc_cole » Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:09 am

sooskriszta wrote:If the mega menus can't be made into a configurable/removable module, then my vote is for current design sans mega menus.
+1

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Post by Xsecrets » Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:13 am

Daniel wrote:I can use the current design if thats what people want. no mega menus.
I would keep the mega menus as they are the biggest new thing in ecommerce, however it should be an option so that people who don't want it can turn it off with a simple setting in the admin. That can't be hard to do. It might take a slight tweaking of the template to make it look ok with and without it, but shouldn't be a big deal.

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Post by Xsecrets » Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:15 am

marc_cole wrote:
cevarief wrote:i hate smarty
Personally, I would like to see the addition of a templating system like PHPTAL. It allows you to use HTML apps like Dreamweaver and actually see what the layout looks like since it uses XML-like tags. Having templates like this would open the door to a lot more designers, since it would make it a heck of a lot easier to design tpl files. This could be very beneficial to the OpenCart community.

It's been under constant development since 2005, so maybe it's worth looking into?

Marc
Last time I check and it was some time ago and I don't really think they removed it dreamweaver handled php just fine. it showed it to you in the code view and put a little icon in the design view how would PHPTAL be any different?

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Post by Qphoria » Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:35 am

Xsecrets wrote:
Daniel wrote:I can use the current design if thats what people want. no mega menus.
I would keep the mega menus as they are the biggest new thing in ecommerce, however it should be an option so that people who don't want it can turn it off with a simple setting in the admin. That can't be hard to do. It might take a slight tweaking of the template to make it look ok with and without it, but shouldn't be a big deal.
Make it modular so you can choose to enable/disable it. or if someone wants to make another mega menu it is easily swappable.

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