Post by Mac++ » Fri Jan 07, 2011 12:28 am

Daniel wrote:
I disagreee completly. I don't think you lose a sinlge sale from not knowing the shipping price until you create an account. one page checkout systems have been known to lose sales if thats what your getting at.

Also what is your solution to calculate shipping before a customer enters any information.

it seems a bit redundent to enter your postcode or country and zone for shipping on the cart page then enter it again for registering.

I agree, I dont think any sale lose for not knowing the shipping price before a guest member fill the registri form, but a solution for calculate the shipping cost before a custumer enters any information could be use a IP Locator to calculate the shipping price for a member to shop like guest. like ip2location.

Is just an idea, good job Daniel, I waiting for the 1.5 release, there any early date to test the new version?

And the alertpay module will be included in the 1.5 version?

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Post by sabitertan » Fri Jan 07, 2011 12:45 am

why there is no github like maintaining for opencart? It can help moving the project towards.

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Post by Qphoria » Fri Jan 07, 2011 12:53 am

Mac++ wrote: And the alertpay module will be included in the 1.5 version?

Mac++.
Alertpay is already in the core.. we are not removing any existing at this time

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Post by Mac++ » Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:01 am

Qphoria wrote:
Mac++ wrote: And the alertpay module will be included in the 1.5 version?

Mac++.
Alertpay is already in the core.. we are not removing any existing at this time
Thanks Qphoria, I'm glad hear that.

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Post by alex1 » Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:07 am

Daniel wrote:I disagreee completly. I don't think you lose a sinlge sale from not knowing the shipping price until you create an account. one page checkout systems have been known to lose sales if thats what your getting at.
In the US, it's almost standard to be able to see the shipping price before you give any information... people only need to enter their zipcode to see this. It calculates based on weight and zipcode for a shipping price.

That reminds me of the Google Base module. If shipping is free (shipping not required), the module should pass to Google Base this info. Otherwise the competitors show free shipping while opencart owners do not.
Daniel wrote: Also what is your solution to calculate shipping before a customer enters any information.
When someone adds to cart, there should be a text box to allow them to enter in a zipcode to calculate shipping. This should probably only be an option for US based transactions.
Daniel wrote: it seems a bit redundent to enter your postcode or country and zone for shipping on the cart page then enter it again for registering.
People love this feature...

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Post by SapporoGuy » Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:43 am

regarding alex1

But you have to know some information for this to work.
Ebay has it, but you are logged in. I doesn't really work though. I live in Japan ;)

ip2ship
that sounds like a better idea, however, it still has problems if you are sitting at LAX waiting for your flight to NYC

Basically, this is a nifty feature but you really do need the fail safe of the customer's intended shipping location. IF not, you will be showing them some arbitrary value.

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Post by alex1 » Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:46 am

SapporoGuy wrote:But you have to know some information for this to work.
Ebay has it, but you are logged in. I doesn't really work though. I live in Japan ;)
For the US all you need to know is the zipcode, and it calculates shipping based on the items in the cart.

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Post by SapporoGuy » Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:01 am

But the point is, how does the cart know the zip code?

I do what a US zip is ... 90210 ... however they are still limited to compared to Japan where you would have something like 90210-001 which would narrow it down to a street or neighborhood.

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Post by marc_cole » Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:23 am

Daniel wrote:I disagreee completly. I don't think you lose a sinlge sale from not knowing the shipping price until you create an account.
This simply isn't true. My business has been web based since '96 and back when I had customers enter their full address before they knew whether or not they wanted to buy from me, I had people call and complain about it.

I, myself, will walk away from a site that asks for my info before I know the exact cost plus shipping. Why should I waste my time filling out that info only to find that the shipping cost is too high? And now that the media is instructing everyone about the security issues on the Internet, even the people who didn't care before will likely think twice before giving their personal info too soon.

Anything we can do to make the customer happy helps in making a sale, and knowing the exact shipping cost by only entering your Zip Code shows me that a company is catering to the customer and is not out just to collect information. I will always buy from a site like that.

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Post by Qphoria » Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:24 am

SapporoGuy wrote:I do what a US zip is ... 90210 ... however they are still limited to compared to Japan where you would have something like 90210-001 which would narrow it down to a street or neighborhood.
US zips also have 4 extra optional digits for specific locations:
http://www.9digitzipcodes.com/Beverly-H ... 651bd.html

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Post by Daniel » Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:36 am

SapporoGuy wrote:I slept on this:

@ Daniel
I don't know if you have ever lived in Hong Kong or made a big international move or even if you speak Cantonese ...
The following is based on being a newbie...
But I say it would be very wise to a lot yourself at least 1 month to get used to the new world.
I live in Northern Japan in Sapporo and when I was 22 it was hard enough to accept that life is no longer what you know it.
This is Asia and not some Western country. Pros and Cons either way it is a new adventure.

Is wife and children going to?
If not, it will be tough to be away but then again Japanese men live for years at a time in different cities because of work and they .. well ... they :joker:

Cheers and I really do hope that this is a move up for you.

@ 1.5 release
So, instead of rushing out a release to appease the animals.

For reasons based on just moving ....
I'd say do it in steps:
1.) release a alpha to a select group on testers chosen by the 2 of you.
2.) let them pound on the base code and provide feedback and / or make changes
3.) either introduce the new features or let them add them in

At the moment (not knowing what or why you are going to be in Hong Kong) for but I'd say, the current plan that you proposed is going to cause a lot more problems than not.

For reasons on the possibility that Daniel is going to be a "Hong Kong Bachelor" ....
I'd say the way of doing business alone is going to cause problems.
You go out to dinner after work, then get the drinks, then slosh your way on the train or taxi ...
If you don't do it then you don't build the business relationships that so much built over those pints of beers ...

* The above probably needs correction by somebody has done or does the Hong Kong thing. I'm looking at it from the SonyLand view point.

I hope that I AM "chicken little" and running around with my head cut off and crying the sky is falling.
However, take it from a 17 year veteran in Asia ... Prince had it right, he's gonna party like it's 1999!

So, maybe it would be best for D & Q decide one a plan B to safe guard opencart.

Or do you guys already have that planned?

I lived in HK for about 4 years. I'm married to a chinese wife and we have 2 kids. My plan is to rent a serviced appartment with a swimming pool and gym near a beach. I already own an appartment in HK but in the process of selling it.

I'm not going over to meet business contacts. I just want to enjoy life a bit more now OpenCart has grown enough to cover my living expenses.

Last time I worked in HK i was getting home at 9pm every night which is not good if you have a family and your kids rarely see you.

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Post by SapporoGuy » Fri Jan 07, 2011 3:01 am

@ zipcodes
Didn't need to see the N. Bev Drv. address ;)

@ Sort of back to shipping estimatort
So, add on a module/extension/hack to pull shipping cost from the zip.
I don't see what the big deal is.

Let's if we calculate this out:

10% of customers walk away. You have a 100 a month. So we have 10 people x 12 months = 120 folks that didn't stop by your shop.

If you make the standard 30% profit like a business should. And we take a typical item for lets $30. You make $9 off that.

1200 folks x $9 lost = $1080 .... yep you are right that is some hard cold cash being lost.
Now let's make this more fun.
We have about 10 people here that need this.
$1080 x 10 opencart users = $10,800 DAMMMMMMMMMMM :o :o :o :o

Since, I'm setting up a daily deals type of site, so in that spirit.
I'll give you a huge discout.
I'll do that mod for 20% of the $10,800

I can have it ready before the 20th.
And I'll will make 30%~50% from that 20%!

You give me 50% of that lost revenue. I'll have it done by the 14th. I need a few days to find developer who is faster.
And I'll still cut a profit.

* note: 50% down, 25% on visual demo, 25% after install.

Now, think about this way ... you pay $2k for a mod and you save $8k!
That is a bargin!

We haven't even talked about long term savings ... multiple that by 10 years! YOU SAVE EIGHTY THOUSAND DOLLARS!!!
One more time, $80,000, you know 80,000 green backs, or 8,000 George Washingtons!

For those who prefer a more gentile life ....
a 977 carrera .... can you hear that engine roar yet?
No ?
OK, the new Boxster S .... can you feel the wind blowing in your hair?
NO ?
Can you see the wind blowing in the hair of that hot bird next to you?
Not really!!!
Boy are you a tough sell ...
1 last chance!
Can you see how that bird is smiling mischievously at you will you are rolling down the PCH?
Yes! I thought so!

So, folks ... who is willing to put their money up for this?
PM me and I'll give you my paypal information!

O0


To be honest ...
I'd rather see a lot more done on the core code than features.

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Post by SapporoGuy » Fri Jan 07, 2011 3:08 am

/* OFF topic start */

@ Daniel / Hong Kong
Cool! So do you speak and write?

Land prices in Japan keep dropping. However, I took the hit since it would end up being cheaper than renting.
I'm looking forward to losing 50%+ on the price of my house.....

OH! Aren't you the lucky guy!
You're moving back right before New Years! wahahaha, I hope that you don't have a lot of relatives with kids ::)

Hmmmm, I hope that you don't have the "before the soup cools" type of system. This time around I check out what mom's thoughts were on running back home. I got a great answer. As long as I don't see bruises she's out of the house before I go to sleep! Brilliant! Lovely Lass she is ;D

/* End off topic */

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Post by Qphoria » Fri Jan 07, 2011 3:23 am

SapporoGuy wrote: @ Daniel / Hong Kong
Cool! So do you speak and write?
Yes, the next version of opencart will default to hànzì instead of english

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Post by Xsecrets » Fri Jan 07, 2011 3:24 am

SapporoGuy wrote: @ Sort of back to shipping estimatort
So, add on a module/extension/hack to pull shipping cost from the zip.
I don't see what the big deal is.
there already is a mod for this, but for some reason some people aren't happy unless their pet requirement is built into the core.

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Post by Daniel » Fri Jan 07, 2011 4:09 am

SapporoGuy wrote:/* OFF topic start */

@ Daniel / Hong Kong
Cool! So do you speak and write?

Land prices in Japan keep dropping. However, I took the hit since it would end up being cheaper than renting.
I'm looking forward to losing 50%+ on the price of my house.....

OH! Aren't you the lucky guy!
You're moving back right before New Years! wahahaha, I hope that you don't have a lot of relatives with kids ::)

Hmmmm, I hope that you don't have the "before the soup cools" type of system. This time around I check out what mom's thoughts were on running back home. I got a great answer. As long as I don't see bruises she's out of the house before I go to sleep! Brilliant! Lovely Lass she is ;D

/* End off topic */
I speak a little catonese. I can ask for beer, mcdonalds and tell a girl shes pretty.

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Post by Qphoria » Fri Jan 07, 2011 4:11 am

Daniel wrote: I speak a little catonese. I can ask for beer, mcdonalds and tell a girl shes pretty.
Which is all you really need :)

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Post by SapporoGuy » Fri Jan 07, 2011 4:18 am

@ X
errr, that was joke, unless somebody really did want to put up the cash ;)

@ Q
I actually could live with that since we'd 100% have double byte UTF-8 happiness ;D

なまらウケル!
中国語対よだ〜〜〜〜!
ダンニエルさん!

woooooo! That was a serious Freudian slip !

Code: Select all

Which is all you really need 
beer (japanese doesn't have plurals) + burger + pretty girl
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


@ D
:laugh:
That does see to be the story over here too. However, Micky D's is a little young for me. I like em a tad older.

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Post by OC2PS » Fri Jan 07, 2011 4:42 am

SapporoGuy wrote:ip2ship
that sounds like a better idea, however, it still has problems if you are sitting at LAX waiting for your flight to NYC

Basically, this is a nifty feature but you really do need the fail safe of the customer's intended shipping location. IF not, you will be showing them some arbitrary value.
Just like D/Q/X/i2P/* work to ensure that they aren't trying to please 100% of the people 100% of the time in terms of not including 100% of the feature requests in the product/roadmap, I think when building specific features it is important to think about whether a 100% solution is required.

While for features such as SEO URLs, a solution needs to be (and in my experience is) pretty fail-safe (and shouldn't break with updates, etc), for shipping cost calculator, it is not imperative that the solution is airtight.

If shipping price is shown correctly to 99% users based on their IP, and incorrectly if, say, you are in LAX going home to NYC, or buying for an aunt who lives in ATL, or are using a proxy or IP-based geo-location is unavailable or false, then that would be acceptable to most...it could be as simple as putting a disclaimer that shipping would depend on location or *this is an estimate. exact shipping price calculated based on shipping location as entered in checkout*....

It is a good, beneficial feature to have. It's up to the project team to decide whether they want to include it in the core product and how they want to prioritize it. But to say that it's a useless feature because we can only get it 99% right, is not fair.

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Post by SapporoGuy » Fri Jan 07, 2011 5:17 am

Of course, I want features to be added and they won't be and that's not fair either.
However, in this case X has already stepped in and said there is a module for this.

So, I really don't understand the problem at the moment.
It can always be added in at future point of time, especially since there is a solution available.

What is the problem then?
I really can't understand this.

How about writing a list of priorities that will satisfy the 90 percentile mark?
I for 1 don't need a shipping estimator at the moment and if I really did need it and my shop depended on those 10% lazy customers who didn't really like my shop, nor my prices, nor my write up then I would pay the cash because I have already calculated out that roughly US $10k is being lost on 10 users here in the forums. I have no idea the price of that module but even at $60 dollars (the price of a few beer with friends) I would say that just by buying that module I'd be saving enough money every year to go drinking almost every weekend.

So????

Somebody please explain were my logic is wrong on this?
I must be really stupid because I don't get why people are complaining about stuff missing.

IF Daniel weren't moving with his family from the opposite side of the world, yeah maybe I'm be pitching in but that is not the case. Give the guy a break for a month and then start griping. ;)

That is coming from one of the biggest gripe campaigners here on the board!

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